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	<title>Comments on: Centrist still</title>
	<atom:link href="http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/</link>
	<description>Fearlessly dispensing political, legal and economic analysis (and some whimsy) since 2002</description>
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		<title>By: joelb</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-88638</link>
		<dc:creator>joelb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jan 2007 02:39:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-88638</guid>
		<description>Interestingly, I attempted to give as undecided an answer as I could (answering in the mid range for every question) and was classed as a onenation suporter. I would have thought that most (?) members of One nation had strong views on many of the questions in the test?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interestingly, I attempted to give as undecided an answer as I could (answering in the mid range for every question) and was classed as a onenation suporter. I would have thought that most (?) members of One nation had strong views on many of the questions in the test?</p>
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		<title>By: Sacha</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-88264</link>
		<dc:creator>Sacha</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Jan 2007 09:17:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-88264</guid>
		<description>The &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.ldp.org.au/quiz/index.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;quiz on the LDP site&lt;/a&gt; had the two-dimensional scale I was thinking about.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The <a href="http://www.ldp.org.au/quiz/index.html">quiz on the LDP site</a> had the two-dimensional scale I was thinking about.</p>
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		<title>By: Sacha</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-88259</link>
		<dc:creator>Sacha</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Jan 2007 09:09:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-88259</guid>
		<description>Here&#039;s mine:

Political outlook
Your broad political orientation score is -9.1%, which equates to a &#039;Centre&#039; position

Economic policy
Your economic policy score score is 56.9%. This equates to a &#039;Right&#039; position

Social policy
Your social policy score is 9.8%. This equates to a &#039;Centre&#039; position

Traditional values
Your traditional values score is -85.2%. This equates to a &#039;Far Left&#039; position

A unidimensional scale is probably less interesting than the two-dimensional scale I&#039;ve seen elsewhere (economic liberalness and social liberalness). I&#039;ve done similar quizzes before (probably the US one) and came out fairly similarly, but my responses change - tomorrow I might respond differently! A few months ago on the US test I had negative scores on all three scales.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s mine:</p>
<p>Political outlook<br />
Your broad political orientation score is -9.1%, which equates to a &#8216;Centre&#8217; position</p>
<p>Economic policy<br />
Your economic policy score score is 56.9%. This equates to a &#8216;Right&#8217; position</p>
<p>Social policy<br />
Your social policy score is 9.8%. This equates to a &#8216;Centre&#8217; position</p>
<p>Traditional values<br />
Your traditional values score is -85.2%. This equates to a &#8216;Far Left&#8217; position</p>
<p>A unidimensional scale is probably less interesting than the two-dimensional scale I&#8217;ve seen elsewhere (economic liberalness and social liberalness). I&#8217;ve done similar quizzes before (probably the US one) and came out fairly similarly, but my responses change &#8211; tomorrow I might respond differently! A few months ago on the US test I had negative scores on all three scales.</p>
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		<title>By: Yobbo</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87762</link>
		<dc:creator>Yobbo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Jan 2007 08:37:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87762</guid>
		<description>Changing your pseudonym certainly hasn&#039;t made you any less of a tosser, has it Niall?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Changing your pseudonym certainly hasn&#8217;t made you any less of a tosser, has it Niall?</p>
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		<title>By: Jason Soon</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87754</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason Soon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Jan 2007 08:19:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87754</guid>
		<description>so tell us your results, Hyper-idiot Bannerman.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>so tell us your results, Hyper-idiot Bannerman.</p>
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		<title>By: Bannerman</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87751</link>
		<dc:creator>Bannerman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Jan 2007 08:08:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87751</guid>
		<description>Clearky, Parish is a rightie, judging from his results. Not that the quiz is in any way definitive, or even rational. Bannerman means to say.....well, some of those questions....SHEESH!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Clearky, Parish is a rightie, judging from his results. Not that the quiz is in any way definitive, or even rational. Bannerman means to say&#8230;..well, some of those questions&#8230;.SHEESH!</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Bahnisch</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87716</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Bahnisch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Jan 2007 05:21:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87716</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s a function of the categories and the dichotomisation, whyisitso. You can still have expansive social policy goals - recognising as social democrats do that freedom is only meaningful if there are equal opportunities for people to develop the capacities to exercise it - but disagree with intrusive and interventionist ways of achieving it. Similarly with economic policy - you can have broad goals which are best met by market incentives which are nevertheless not &quot;a free market&quot;. A lot of what I would like to advocate simply isn&#039;t captured by the alternatives given, and I think from the point of view of political philosophy, the blurbs you quote are very simplistic.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s a function of the categories and the dichotomisation, whyisitso. You can still have expansive social policy goals &#8211; recognising as social democrats do that freedom is only meaningful if there are equal opportunities for people to develop the capacities to exercise it &#8211; but disagree with intrusive and interventionist ways of achieving it. Similarly with economic policy &#8211; you can have broad goals which are best met by market incentives which are nevertheless not &#8220;a free market&#8221;. A lot of what I would like to advocate simply isn&#8217;t captured by the alternatives given, and I think from the point of view of political philosophy, the blurbs you quote are very simplistic.</p>
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		<title>By: whyisitso</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87699</link>
		<dc:creator>whyisitso</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Jan 2007 03:59:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87699</guid>
		<description>I realise this test is just a bit of fun, although there does seem to be a consensus among the comments that the site&#039;s reckoning is not too far away from the self-assessments.

I&#039;m not going to trawl through Mark&#039;s many posts to establish what I have long sensed to be his statist beliefs, so I&#039;ll withdraw my assessment until I&#039;ve got time for his gotcha game.

What I found interesting however are his scores on economic and social policy that according to Brian Palmer&#039;s explanations are highly suggestive of a statist mindset.  Maybe he agreed with only those propositions in those areas that weren&#039;t indicative of statist thinking.  But as I said it&#039;s unscientific and just a bit of fun.

&quot;Your economic policy score reports the extent to which you think the state should be regulating the economic aspects of our lives. A negative score means you believe the state should, on more issues than not, intervene in the economic lives of its citizens. A positive score means you believe the state should be less interventionist. 

Your social policy score reports the extent to which you think the state should be providing services for its citizens and protecting its citizens from making decisions that could be harmful (in social policy areas other than those covered by the traditional values score below). A negative score means you believe the state should, on more issues than not, intervene in the social lives of its citizens as a force for good. A positive score means you believe we are responsible enough to provide for ourselves and run our own lives free from excessive government intervention.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I realise this test is just a bit of fun, although there does seem to be a consensus among the comments that the site&#8217;s reckoning is not too far away from the self-assessments.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not going to trawl through Mark&#8217;s many posts to establish what I have long sensed to be his statist beliefs, so I&#8217;ll withdraw my assessment until I&#8217;ve got time for his gotcha game.</p>
<p>What I found interesting however are his scores on economic and social policy that according to Brian Palmer&#8217;s explanations are highly suggestive of a statist mindset.  Maybe he agreed with only those propositions in those areas that weren&#8217;t indicative of statist thinking.  But as I said it&#8217;s unscientific and just a bit of fun.</p>
<p>&#8220;Your economic policy score reports the extent to which you think the state should be regulating the economic aspects of our lives. A negative score means you believe the state should, on more issues than not, intervene in the economic lives of its citizens. A positive score means you believe the state should be less interventionist. </p>
<p>Your social policy score reports the extent to which you think the state should be providing services for its citizens and protecting its citizens from making decisions that could be harmful (in social policy areas other than those covered by the traditional values score below). A negative score means you believe the state should, on more issues than not, intervene in the social lives of its citizens as a force for good. A positive score means you believe we are responsible enough to provide for ourselves and run our own lives free from excessive government intervention.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Yobbo</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87695</link>
		<dc:creator>Yobbo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Jan 2007 03:43:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87695</guid>
		<description>You guys can also &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.ldp.org.au/quiz/index.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;try our test here&lt;/a&gt;. See if you like the results better.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You guys can also <a href="http://www.ldp.org.au/quiz/index.html">try our test here</a>. See if you like the results better.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Bahnisch</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87630</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Bahnisch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Jan 2007 00:38:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87630</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;the statist positions so loudly advocated by the Bahnischs&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Such as?

Find me some, and I&#039;ll link to the many posts I&#039;ve written arguing for less statist social policy and more emphasis on liberty from social democrats.

I&#039;ve been consistent on this. 

I don&#039;t think Nick could be characterised as a statist either.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>the statist positions so loudly advocated by the Bahnischs</p></blockquote>
<p>Such as?</p>
<p>Find me some, and I&#8217;ll link to the many posts I&#8217;ve written arguing for less statist social policy and more emphasis on liberty from social democrats.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve been consistent on this. </p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think Nick could be characterised as a statist either.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Bahnisch</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87629</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Bahnisch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Jan 2007 00:36:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87629</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;And I think you&#039;re also forgetting John Hewson. &lt;/blockquote&gt;

Fair cop, but he&#039;s pretty forgettable!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>And I think you&#8217;re also forgetting John Hewson. </p></blockquote>
<p>Fair cop, but he&#8217;s pretty forgettable!</p>
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		<title>By: vee</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87618</link>
		<dc:creator>vee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jan 2007 23:47:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87618</guid>
		<description>The problems with the results have been well documented now but I think the question really is &quot;does One Nation still belong up there on that list?&quot;

Isn&#039;t it now non-existent or practically non-existent?  Perhaps we could replace it with the LDP for our libertarian friends? Or just add LDP to the list.

The test is not meant to be taken too seriously (though its the best one I&#039;ve found) and is supposedly based on the parties policies.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The problems with the results have been well documented now but I think the question really is &#8220;does One Nation still belong up there on that list?&#8221;</p>
<p>Isn&#8217;t it now non-existent or practically non-existent?  Perhaps we could replace it with the LDP for our libertarian friends? Or just add LDP to the list.</p>
<p>The test is not meant to be taken too seriously (though its the best one I&#8217;ve found) and is supposedly based on the parties policies.</p>
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		<title>By: Sinclair Davidson</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87593</link>
		<dc:creator>Sinclair Davidson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jan 2007 22:37:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87593</guid>
		<description>Your broad political orientation score is 43.6%, which equates to a &#039;Right&#039; position.
Your economic policy score score is 95.7%. This equates to a &#039;Far Right&#039; position.
Your social policy score is 80.7%. This equates to a &#039;Far Right&#039; position.
Your traditional values score is -43.5%. This equates to a &#039;Left&#039; position.

The problem with this metric is that it measures economic views in three different ways, but social views once. I would have thought that political, economic policy and social policy scores would be highly positively correlated.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your broad political orientation score is 43.6%, which equates to a &#8216;Right&#8217; position.<br />
Your economic policy score score is 95.7%. This equates to a &#8216;Far Right&#8217; position.<br />
Your social policy score is 80.7%. This equates to a &#8216;Far Right&#8217; position.<br />
Your traditional values score is -43.5%. This equates to a &#8216;Left&#8217; position.</p>
<p>The problem with this metric is that it measures economic views in three different ways, but social views once. I would have thought that political, economic policy and social policy scores would be highly positively correlated.</p>
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		<title>By: whyisitso</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87584</link>
		<dc:creator>whyisitso</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jan 2007 21:32:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87584</guid>
		<description>While Ken is assessed as a Centrist, I think this is true only on average.  It&#039;s the old example that if you bathe one leg in boiling water and the other in freezing water, on average you will experience a very comfortable temperature.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>While Ken is assessed as a Centrist, I think this is true only on average.  It&#8217;s the old example that if you bathe one leg in boiling water and the other in freezing water, on average you will experience a very comfortable temperature.</p>
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		<title>By: whyisitso</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87582</link>
		<dc:creator>whyisitso</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jan 2007 21:25:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87582</guid>
		<description>Remarkable similarity between Ken Parish&#039;s and Geoff Honnor&#039;s readings!  Yet as a Right-Far Right commenter I personally find Geoff&#039;s commentaries far more palatable and sensible than Ken&#039;s.

Regrettably I have to agree with Mark&#039;s assessment that &quot;The thing is though that libertarians traditionally are a very small current in what is a very statist political culture on both sides of the aisle in Australia.&quot;  While I&#039;m obviously not a libertarian I find libertarian philosophies far more agreeable than the statist positions so loudly advocated by the Bahnischs, Gruens and Quiggans of this world.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Remarkable similarity between Ken Parish&#8217;s and Geoff Honnor&#8217;s readings!  Yet as a Right-Far Right commenter I personally find Geoff&#8217;s commentaries far more palatable and sensible than Ken&#8217;s.</p>
<p>Regrettably I have to agree with Mark&#8217;s assessment that &#8220;The thing is though that libertarians traditionally are a very small current in what is a very statist political culture on both sides of the aisle in Australia.&#8221;  While I&#8217;m obviously not a libertarian I find libertarian philosophies far more agreeable than the statist positions so loudly advocated by the Bahnischs, Gruens and Quiggans of this world.</p>
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		<title>By: meika</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87576</link>
		<dc:creator>meika</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jan 2007 20:59:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87576</guid>
		<description>In looking at the summaries it appears that the quizz&#039;s &lt;b&gt;centre left&lt;/b&gt;is the new middle (or at least median) of views. It even includes us non-pro-statist&#039;s (libertarian or anarchist). Pity we can&#039;t get past the football tribalism of the traditional parties.

Amanda I&#039;m going to miss your tempering influence on the conservatives. Woe!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In looking at the summaries it appears that the quizz&#8217;s <b>centre left</b>is the new middle (or at least median) of views. It even includes us non-pro-statist&#8217;s (libertarian or anarchist). Pity we can&#8217;t get past the football tribalism of the traditional parties.</p>
<p>Amanda I&#8217;m going to miss your tempering influence on the conservatives. Woe!</p>
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		<title>By: Geoff Honnor</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87574</link>
		<dc:creator>Geoff Honnor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jan 2007 20:35:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87574</guid>
		<description>Political Outlook - Centre -1.7%

Economic Policy - Centre Right  42.1%

Social Policy - Centre Right  27.4%

Trad Values - Left -58.9%</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Political Outlook &#8211; Centre -1.7%</p>
<p>Economic Policy &#8211; Centre Right  42.1%</p>
<p>Social Policy &#8211; Centre Right  27.4%</p>
<p>Trad Values &#8211; Left -58.9%</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Norton</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87571</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Norton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jan 2007 20:31:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87571</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m getting the same pattern (though slightly different numbers) as the other libertarians/classical liberals. 

As Ken says, the party matches aren&#039;t working. Mine is right, but his software is correctly predicting less than half.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m getting the same pattern (though slightly different numbers) as the other libertarians/classical liberals. </p>
<p>As Ken says, the party matches aren&#8217;t working. Mine is right, but his software is correctly predicting less than half.</p>
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		<title>By: Yobbo</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87545</link>
		<dc:creator>Yobbo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:36:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87545</guid>
		<description>And I think you&#039;re also forgetting John Hewson.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And I think you&#8217;re also forgetting John Hewson.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Bahnisch</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87495</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Bahnisch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:42:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87495</guid>
		<description>Yobbo, yes and Hyde was influential as a sort of ginger group back bencher. But I was thinking of people at the top of the party. Ken&#039;s example of his possible voting intentions invited that response.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yobbo, yes and Hyde was influential as a sort of ginger group back bencher. But I was thinking of people at the top of the party. Ken&#8217;s example of his possible voting intentions invited that response.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Bahnisch</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87494</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Bahnisch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:41:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87494</guid>
		<description>I believe you, JC, and the interesting question (posed in somewhat a different way by Andrew Norton) is what do the liberal Liberals do when Howard goes - particularly if he is defeated.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I believe you, JC, and the interesting question (posed in somewhat a different way by Andrew Norton) is what do the liberal Liberals do when Howard goes &#8211; particularly if he is defeated.</p>
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		<title>By: JC</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87473</link>
		<dc:creator>JC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:55:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87473</guid>
		<description>Compare that to Humphries work and toil.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Compare that to Humphries work and toil.</p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: JC</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87472</link>
		<dc:creator>JC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:53:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87472</guid>
		<description>Who never did anything Yobbo other than sit in a cozy office, write a couple of books, go to self-congratulatory dinners and pick up a couple cheques each month. When you have Hugh Morgan running that crowd you know it&#039;s going the same way as the WMC stock price while his running the show.

Sorry if I sound a little bitter but that&#039;s how I see it with that lot in unsunny Melbourne.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Who never did anything Yobbo other than sit in a cozy office, write a couple of books, go to self-congratulatory dinners and pick up a couple cheques each month. When you have Hugh Morgan running that crowd you know it&#8217;s going the same way as the WMC stock price while his running the show.</p>
<p>Sorry if I sound a little bitter but that&#8217;s how I see it with that lot in unsunny Melbourne.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Yobbo</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87470</link>
		<dc:creator>Yobbo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:47:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87470</guid>
		<description>Kennett wasn&#039;t the best example. &lt;a href=&quot;http://ipa.org.au/people/bio.asp?peopleid=6&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;John Hyde&lt;/a&gt; is a lifelong libertarian.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kennett wasn&#8217;t the best example. <a href="http://ipa.org.au/people/bio.asp?peopleid=6">John Hyde</a> is a lifelong libertarian.</p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: JC</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87460</link>
		<dc:creator>JC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:21:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/01/23/centrist-still/#comment-87460</guid>
		<description>Mark
I can&#039;t see much of a difference on the cultural side between the two parties. Maybe I am wrong on this but both seem to be pretty conservative as a bunch, with labor just ahead by a couple of nose hair lengths in being socially more liberal (note small l)

There is a big difference at the grass roots level though, particularly within the state I reside. The libs have a sizable margin of supporters that could easily fit into the libertarian, easy social policy Friedman economics wing if there ever was one. There is some serious grumbling at the grass roots with the big spending attitude and the way one particular clown has taken hold of the party operational structure. You saw a little of this with the rise of Prodos and then the party structure indecently killing his candidacy in an electorate that was as close to the safest labor seat in the state that the Libs had never contested before. Kroger and his henchmen took out his candidacy, which is something I will never forgive them for until Kroger and his cabal is banished.

I would hazard to bet that 10-15% of the party grass roots has libertarian leanings. Believe me it is there, really upset and restless.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark<br />
I can&#8217;t see much of a difference on the cultural side between the two parties. Maybe I am wrong on this but both seem to be pretty conservative as a bunch, with labor just ahead by a couple of nose hair lengths in being socially more liberal (note small l)</p>
<p>There is a big difference at the grass roots level though, particularly within the state I reside. The libs have a sizable margin of supporters that could easily fit into the libertarian, easy social policy Friedman economics wing if there ever was one. There is some serious grumbling at the grass roots with the big spending attitude and the way one particular clown has taken hold of the party operational structure. You saw a little of this with the rise of Prodos and then the party structure indecently killing his candidacy in an electorate that was as close to the safest labor seat in the state that the Libs had never contested before. Kroger and his henchmen took out his candidacy, which is something I will never forgive them for until Kroger and his cabal is banished.</p>
<p>I would hazard to bet that 10-15% of the party grass roots has libertarian leanings. Believe me it is there, really upset and restless.</p>
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