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	<title>Comments on: Assembling some thoughts on industry policy: Part One</title>
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	<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/</link>
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		<title>By: Club Troppo &#187; Congratulations Dani Rodrik - winner of the Albert O. Hirschman Prize</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-117666</link>
		<dc:creator>Club Troppo &#187; Congratulations Dani Rodrik - winner of the Albert O. Hirschman Prize</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Apr 2007 11:03:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-117666</guid>
		<description>[...] far) he engages in very Krugmaneque catching of economic pundits in various inadvertent lapses into what I call pre-Ricardian [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] far) he engages in very Krugmaneque catching of economic pundits in various inadvertent lapses into what I call pre-Ricardian [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Nicholas Gruen</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-116474</link>
		<dc:creator>Nicholas Gruen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Apr 2007 04:46:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-116474</guid>
		<description>Tom, here is page 9 of the 1991-92 Annual Report &quot;If Australia does not at least match the productivity performance of other nations, competitiveness and relative living standards will decline&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tom, here is page 9 of the 1991-92 Annual Report &#8220;If Australia does not at least match the productivity performance of other nations, competitiveness and relative living standards will decline&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: Nicholas Gruen</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-115036</link>
		<dc:creator>Nicholas Gruen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Apr 2007 14:29:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-115036</guid>
		<description>Yes it&#039;s not directly on point - but I&#039;m still out of base.  Why don&#039;t you have a look at those annual reports and let me know what you find.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes it&#8217;s not directly on point &#8211; but I&#8217;m still out of base.  Why don&#8217;t you have a look at those annual reports and let me know what you find.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom N.</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-115015</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom N.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Apr 2007 08:49:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-115015</guid>
		<description>I remember the Commission&#039;s use of GDP comparisons in that way well, and indeed I made some criticisms of it myself. However, that&#039;s a different point from using the </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I remember the Commission&#8217;s use of GDP comparisons in that way well, and indeed I made some criticisms of it myself. However, that&#8217;s a different point from using the</p>
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		<title>By: Nicholas Gruen</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-114681</link>
		<dc:creator>Nicholas Gruen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Apr 2007 14:28:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-114681</guid>
		<description>Tom,

I&#039;m out of my base right now, but you can have a look at the Annual Reports around 1989-1992 and there are frequent references to Australia&#039;s &#039;competitiveness&#039;. I can find the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.pc.gov.au/ic/inquiry/index.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;reports of inquiries&lt;/a&gt; on the PC site, but not the annual reports - though they may be there. 

From my hard disc here is something Steve Dowrick wrote at around the same time on a related theme of international comparisons.

&lt;blockquote&gt;[T]he IC cite figures that purport to show that over the 1980s, Australia&#039;s GNP per capita grew at an annual rate of some six percentage points below the performance of &#039;the dynamic Asian economics to our north. . .  In particular, they suggest that the standard of living in Japan, measured in US dollars, was the same as Australia&#039;s in 1980 and was some 66 per cent higher by 1989. . . . These IC comparisons perpetrate one of the most basic mistakes that can be made in the field of international economic comparisons, namely an assumption that exchange rates between currencies reflect purchasing-power parities.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

In King, S. and Lloyd. P, Economic Rationalism, Allen and Unwin, 1993</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tom,</p>
<p>I&#8217;m out of my base right now, but you can have a look at the Annual Reports around 1989-1992 and there are frequent references to Australia&#8217;s &#8216;competitiveness&#8217;. I can find the <a href="http://www.pc.gov.au/ic/inquiry/index.html">reports of inquiries</a> on the PC site, but not the annual reports &#8211; though they may be there. </p>
<p>From my hard disc here is something Steve Dowrick wrote at around the same time on a related theme of international comparisons.</p>
<blockquote><p>[T]he IC cite figures that purport to show that over the 1980s, Australia&#8217;s GNP per capita grew at an annual rate of some six percentage points below the performance of &#8216;the dynamic Asian economics to our north. . .  In particular, they suggest that the standard of living in Japan, measured in US dollars, was the same as Australia&#8217;s in 1980 and was some 66 per cent higher by 1989. . . . These IC comparisons perpetrate one of the most basic mistakes that can be made in the field of international economic comparisons, namely an assumption that exchange rates between currencies reflect purchasing-power parities.</p></blockquote>
<p>In King, S. and Lloyd. P, Economic Rationalism, Allen and Unwin, 1993</p>
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		<title>By: Tom N.</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-114659</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom N.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Apr 2007 10:24:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-114659</guid>
		<description>Nick said: &lt;i&gt;&quot;There are some embarrassing passages which read the same way in Industry Commission publications of the early 1990s just before Krugman came out with his critique.&quot;&lt;/i&gt;

Really? Can you point some of them out. I also thought the IC was pretty sceptical of all this stuff, and simply mentioned it - to demonstrate that it was aware of it - without ever given it any credence.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nick said: <i>&#8220;There are some embarrassing passages which read the same way in Industry Commission publications of the early 1990s just before Krugman came out with his critique.&#8221;</i></p>
<p>Really? Can you point some of them out. I also thought the IC was pretty sceptical of all this stuff, and simply mentioned it &#8211; to demonstrate that it was aware of it &#8211; without ever given it any credence.</p>
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		<title>By: Nicholas Gruen</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-114650</link>
		<dc:creator>Nicholas Gruen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Apr 2007 07:33:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-114650</guid>
		<description>Well lets say you want to export things from Kuwait. You only have to get out a post hole digger and you strike oil. (I exaggerate, but then I have seen you exaggerate too Rex, so you will have to let that one go through to the keeper.)

You have x million people and they like to have nice headgear and other things. When they want to upgrade their headgear they need foreign exchange. How do they get it?  Well they could go to the trouble of producing some high skill product - say bionic ears. They would then need to employ a lot of skilled people, have expertise in managing them and financing their projects. And they&#039;d have to risk the possibility that the Australian and US competitors would end up producing a superior product &#039;leapfrogging&#039; their own technology. 

At this point the idea of a post hole digger would be hard to get out of the average Kuwaiti mind. People would just be saying - they might even write into the local paper - &#039;why don&#039;t we just get more post hole diggers&#039; and then we can upgrade our headgear. 

Of course Kuwatis might well find fancy ways of adding value to oil or its discovery.  They might pioneer some innovation in post hole diggers.  But they&#039;d have to pay people a fair bit to pioneer it, and they&#039;d all be thinking of how much money they could make with existing post hole diggers.  So even the post hole diggers might get improved elsewhere.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well lets say you want to export things from Kuwait. You only have to get out a post hole digger and you strike oil. (I exaggerate, but then I have seen you exaggerate too Rex, so you will have to let that one go through to the keeper.)</p>
<p>You have x million people and they like to have nice headgear and other things. When they want to upgrade their headgear they need foreign exchange. How do they get it?  Well they could go to the trouble of producing some high skill product &#8211; say bionic ears. They would then need to employ a lot of skilled people, have expertise in managing them and financing their projects. And they&#8217;d have to risk the possibility that the Australian and US competitors would end up producing a superior product &#8216;leapfrogging&#8217; their own technology. </p>
<p>At this point the idea of a post hole digger would be hard to get out of the average Kuwaiti mind. People would just be saying &#8211; they might even write into the local paper &#8211; &#8216;why don&#8217;t we just get more post hole diggers&#8217; and then we can upgrade our headgear. </p>
<p>Of course Kuwatis might well find fancy ways of adding value to oil or its discovery.  They might pioneer some innovation in post hole diggers.  But they&#8217;d have to pay people a fair bit to pioneer it, and they&#8217;d all be thinking of how much money they could make with existing post hole diggers.  So even the post hole diggers might get improved elsewhere.</p>
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		<title>By: Club Troppo &#187; Industry policy just might work </title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-114647</link>
		<dc:creator>Club Troppo &#187; Industry policy just might work </dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Apr 2007 07:15:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-114647</guid>
		<description>[...] I posted an introductory post on industry policy summarising some of the very good reasons to be suspicious of &#8216;picking [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] I posted an introductory post on industry policy summarising some of the very good reasons to be suspicious of &#8216;picking [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Rex</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-114646</link>
		<dc:creator>Rex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Apr 2007 07:06:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-114646</guid>
		<description>Being neither Evan Thornley nor Jason Soon, and thus still in learning mode when it comes to economics, I don&#039;t get it.   How can commodity  exports &#039;crowd out&#039; the scope for high value exports.  Where&#039;s the constraint in scope? Is it a constraint on capital?  A constraint on skills and workforce (surely not)?  A constraint on the commodity itself (surely only if the ETM is derived from the commodity, like cars are derived from steel).

I just don&#039;t see how having a competive wool export industry can, for example, reduce a country&#039;s ability to design and manufacture aeroplanes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Being neither Evan Thornley nor Jason Soon, and thus still in learning mode when it comes to economics, I don&#8217;t get it.   How can commodity  exports &#8216;crowd out&#8217; the scope for high value exports.  Where&#8217;s the constraint in scope? Is it a constraint on capital?  A constraint on skills and workforce (surely not)?  A constraint on the commodity itself (surely only if the ETM is derived from the commodity, like cars are derived from steel).</p>
<p>I just don&#8217;t see how having a competive wool export industry can, for example, reduce a country&#8217;s ability to design and manufacture aeroplanes.</p>
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		<title>By: Nicholas Gruen</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-114643</link>
		<dc:creator>Nicholas Gruen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Apr 2007 06:16:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-114643</guid>
		<description>Well Rex, my thinking is that you need substantial exports to &#039;leverage&#039; some high value industry capability, but that if you have high value commodity exports, that &#039;crowds out&#039; the scope for expanding other high value exports.  Of course if they&#039;re high value enough the industrial exports can crowd out the commodity exports leaving them for another day, but it&#039;s all on a continuum. 

And are you really Evan Thornley?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well Rex, my thinking is that you need substantial exports to &#8216;leverage&#8217; some high value industry capability, but that if you have high value commodity exports, that &#8216;crowds out&#8217; the scope for expanding other high value exports.  Of course if they&#8217;re high value enough the industrial exports can crowd out the commodity exports leaving them for another day, but it&#8217;s all on a continuum. </p>
<p>And are you really Evan Thornley?</p>
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		<title>By: Rex</title>
		<link>http://clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-114640</link>
		<dc:creator>Rex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Apr 2007 05:47:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.clubtroppo.com.au/2007/04/15/assembling-some-thoughts-on-industry-policy/#comment-114640</guid>
		<description>Why are the potential gains larger if you don</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why are the potential gains larger if you don</p>
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