Paris 2007: Fiji
Posted by Christopher Sheil on Saturday, September 22, 2007
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It’s been a great week for Wallaby fans, with the team winning more positive copy than it has received all year, or two. Well and good, although it’s way too early to start getting carried away. Continuous improvement must be the watchwords for the Wallabies in this World Cup. Australia will put Fiji to the sword on Sunday. But that’s less important than creating a trajectory of continuous improvement through the tournament, which we must do if we’re to steal the thing.
The priority must continue to be on developing our forward play, our scrum, our rolling maul, our pick-and-drive, our counter-attack from breakdowns, for this is where we must eventually match the All Blacks, assuming we get into the semi-finals. The test in playing Fiji lies not in being able to win, and win well, but in being able to maintain, nay positively improve, our teamwork, particularly in the forwards.
In the backs, all eyes will be on the baby superstar, Berrick Barnes. Mark Ella puts his sensational tour into perspective in the Oz today. Fiji will also see the return of the Coopster, who is starting in 13. This is where he says he feels most comfortable, and where Captain Morts reckons Coops will spend his future. The player most desperate for a big outing is Lote Tuqiri. Wayne Smith reviews the problem today. I suspect Knuckles and Co will give him until the finals to show up, but the sooner the better.
Go the Wallabies!
P.S. England versus Samoa could be a cracker. Can Jonny Wilkinson make a difference to these no-hopers, or will the Pommies totally disgrace themselves? Go Samoa!
Update: OK, we won 55-12, scored seven tries, gathered the bonus point and cemented a place in the quarter finals. But for mine, it was the most unsatisfying Wallaby game of the year. The forwards were a dog’s breakfast and the team was sloppy all round. I’m disconcerted by the fact that we’ve already let in more tries than the two previous times that we’ve won the Cup. No way did we look potential World Champions. Maybe this was the let down we had to have. Maybe any team from which you subtract George Smith, Bernie Larkham and Stirling Mortlock is going to look relatively second rate. Having proved their detractors wrong; now the Wallabies have to prove they’re really up for the full tilt.
Crazy Eddie Watch #5: “Rocky Elsom has panned former coach Eddie Jones for turning the Wallabies into a boring team. Elsom suggested leading forwards were banned from showing any adventure on the field and lived in fear of making mistakes before Jones was sacked two years ago.” It’s a big story, getting bigger.
Crazy Eddie Watch #6: “It was reported this week that some of the senior Springboks were considering not wearing their blazers until the South African Rugby Union gave Australian coach Eddie Jones a blazer. But the union said a condition of Jones’s employment was that he would not be given a blazer.” Doncha miss him?
Crazy Eddie Watch #7: From the tapes: “Look John, I know youve got Australian rugbys interests at heart, but did you really have to have Rocky Elsom trash my reputation like that saying that I turned the Wallabies into the most boring side in the world, that I was a control freak who paralysed all the players natural attacking flair because they feared if they made a mistake I would peg them out over an ant bed coated in honey? But you did do that, Eddie, didnt you many still bear the scars from the bull-ant bites? Yes, well you have to set the team parameters from the word go.
[Sign the Bone Growden Petition.]
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“88 Total Signatures.” Heh.
I am going for France.
Its unfortunate this game clashes with the Matildas QF v Brazil on SBS, but do remember to flick over in the ads.
Posted on 22-Sep-07 at 8:25 pm | PermalinkDon’t know what wallaby tastes like but sizzling some tender young roo meat on the backyard barbie was simply delicious this arvo. Their shinbones were right tasty too. Now for some roasted pussy cat.
Posted on 22-Sep-07 at 9:50 pm | PermalinkWell that was England Samoa. Impossible what to make of it, sitting here with blood coming out of the ears and eyes dead-chooked stuck looking somewhere mid-distance-two-o’clock from the most godawful brainscrambling commentary, other than Wilkinson’s field goals after Wilkinson’s field positioning is a problem.
Posted on 23-Sep-07 at 1:54 am | PermalinkSamoa were pretty dreadful. Miles behind the team’s spirit against the Boks. They must have the world’s worst line-out. Still, the Pommies really just made it, almost entirely thanks to Jonny.
The Wallabies will be pleased, as they’re anxious to trash the Poms. The guys should have no worries, except for Jonny’s boot, and the possibility of a shocking ref – if you saw the France-Ireland game, you’ll know what I’m talking about with shocking refs. Remember, one of the eternal verities is that you can’t trust the Poms.
P.S. Re 88 Total Signatures. Heh. OK smarty pants. Amanda, get thee to a signature!
Posted on 23-Sep-07 at 2:13 am | Permalink[...] Paris 2007: Fiji Fiji to the sword on Sunday. But that s less important than creating a trajectory of continuous… we get into the semi-finals. The test in playing Fiji lies not in being able to win, and win well… sensational tour into perspective in the Oz today . Fiji will also see the return of the Coopster, who [...]
Posted on 23-Sep-07 at 7:25 am | PermalinkI don’t sign petitions. Not even the one to get GP into the Country Hall of Fame. I will however happily bone the anonymous scribbler in the Herald last week who started an article: “Conventional wisdom has it that rugby union is played (and followed) by smart people, while rugby league is played (and followed) by dumb people.” If by “bone” you mean “ambush in a dark alley with a dozen mungos sporting an array of Black and Dekker branded product.”
Posted on 23-Sep-07 at 8:54 am | PermalinkOK to make mention of the Matildas first? Part of the magic of our women’s national soccer team is they play a game very different from the men’s. You won’t see a Prima Donna, nor a faked fall, nor the onfield dummy spit from being paid too much and needing another headline. These people really do redefine Australian soccer. I’m a huge fan. And very sorry for their fate tonight our time, and add to the comment above that it’s a crying shame this national team is not televised in its own space for the glory and pleasure and passion of all sports people.
Provided, that is, they don’t threaten us all with heart attacks again.
On Rugby, for mine it was refreshing. For all the stats, the one that won’t be written up is this – how many Australian players have played a Test in full sunlight?
I bet every Fijian has. For mine, I’d say at a mad guess, less than 40%. It could be as low as five. Today’s game suited Fiji in many subtle ways; and we could enjoy this for what it was, and the IRB could learn from it as well. It’s a wonderful way to play rugby, as the sun slowly sets in unison with the combative onfield spirit set to go one way or another.
So the Australian win today in France was about much more than the scoreboard. We’ll digest this game, hopefully, as time rolls on, because it held a good deal of gift for Australian rugby and rugby in general, of the times.
We’ve an alarm bell went off. About the 70th minute or something the Fijians broke from set play through our backline; that is scary shit. It ended in a try to us but that’s not the point. Our maturity, mentally, must come forth on this – for shock waves went through the international players at that point, that such a break could be done.
Speaking of shock waves, Berrick the Barnes’ field goal sent subtle lighting rods through the system, though what he did constituted only split seconds of play. Though subtle and quick, those miniseconds could see the end of Larkham. Points under pressure, al la la la Wilkinson in la la France 07, from broken play in the opposition half is green and gold.
Travel well, Fiji.
A touch of Sid Going at halfback, risk taking taps from two metres out, one handed passes, and hearts that make you want to barrack for them even while they play your own country, and much else to electrify international rugby leaves you, finally, thankful all was well.
Perhaps we can share some thoughts as time goes on here, regarding the value of Fijian Rugby in the contemporary game.
A night of beautiful sportspersonship.
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 12:43 am | PermalinkBarnsey’s field goal was a beauty, and you’re probably right about Fiji Robert. But I can’t help but be cranky about the Wallaby show tonight – except for Gits, who so far is having the time of his life.
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 1:09 am | PermalinkOn the positive, not one Wallaby will walk out of today’s game their time with the desire to pat themselves on the back. But isn’t that what playing Fiji is all about?
I’m trying to think of a game when doing anything but not being injured and trying to hold down a throw-the-coconut-there’s-twenty-of-us-on-the-paddock so there’s a semblance of your own play works as a countering strategy.
How do you see it? To me, the Fijians’ are tougher than France, being very similar in unpredictable play, minus the population and money and yet plussed with bankable emotion.
I’m with you on wanting to see the Australian steam-roller become visible. From other teams’ perspective, however, I think they can only take from this game the backline break against us and Barnsey’s’ danger as anything of substance, given that playing the Fijians is such undefinable territory.
That said, I’d lke to contemplate further where we’re at. The tendency as well in playing Fiji is to make allowances.
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 1:35 am | Permalinkand add to the comment above that its a crying shame this national team is not televised in its own space for the glory and pleasure and passion of all sports people.
Well, all the Matildas games have been live on SBS and the remaining games won’t feature Australia but SBS is still showing them live. So, SBS! So I don’t think there’s much more we can ask. The days of the men’s team being on FTA are long time gone, time out of mind, but I don’t feel the loss right now. It was unfortunate it clashed this time with the Wallabies but I hope more than a few people were flicking between them at least. Go, Matildas! Brazil were certainly the better team but we’re not far behind.
Sorry for non-rah rah content — to make it on topic, I read the Guardian sports pages for the soccer and cricket and general snark and they have alot of coverage including this one which gives the Australian fans a wrap.
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 6:03 am | Permalinkhttp://blogs.guardian.co.uk/sport/2007/09/23/fans_pipe_up_as_australia_show.html
“Go” SBS. Not “So.”
(ps. NZ and Scotland appeared to have been wearing almost identical jumpers. That must have been annoying.)
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 6:45 am | PermalinkThese women.
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 8:58 am | PermalinkUh, ’cause then he’ll really know he was wrong.
I agree it was a shite game. We sucked, Latham, Tuquiri, Mitchell, Elsom, Dunning, Vicks and Gits less than most.
Phil Waugh notably failed to give any impression that he deserves to replace Smith, but Sheperdson did as well as he could against limited opposition, and got around a bit. They clearly were struggling under the sun, except Latham – but they have all played tests in the sunlight, don’t worry about that.
France were much better, and increasing Laporte looks like the muppet of the tournament – his decision to field an attacking but untried combination on the first match seems stupider by the minute. Sarko should reconsider appointing him to the Ministry for Sports and appoint him to remedial education.
On this round’s results, whilst it looks like England will be singing God Save Johnny and Swing True ‘n’ Sweet Johnny for the next week if they are to have a hope in hell of beating Tonga, the combination of the world’s best scrum and Johnny should be enough. Less cheery for Wales who can only dream of a Harlech league to save them from Fiji!
And Ireland are buggered against Argentinia, even though that was one of my picks for match of the tournament. OTOH, Scotland Italy remains a tantalising match-up.
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 9:45 am | PermalinkUh, cause then hell really know he was wrong.
OK, Patrick you’ve talked me out of it. Phew, to think I almost went through with it too.
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 9:51 am | PermalinkTypically, you’d expect a leaguey to get to drunk to go through with it…
I am looking forward to Melbourne’s premiership though. And then to Rugby Union poaching Israel Folau
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 10:53 am | PermalinkUgh. Der Sturm is lesser of two evils, but only just. And Israel is off on Mormon mission apparently soon, so I hope you have a Plan B for the next two years.
Tahu had a great game yesterday, for the Waratah fans.
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 11:12 am | PermalinkGood on him, he wasn’t going anywhere in Australia’s great black [ar**]hole of rugby. What NSW is to state government in Australia NSWRU is to rugby in Australia.
Reading McKenzie’s open job app struck home to me why. He isn’t happy coaching, he wants to be CEO. At NSW, it seems like he is. Someone needs to focus on coaching the team, and on getting results. That includes sacking the players that aren’t really up to it.
Even if I did have to sit through Hewat and Norton-Knight shining on the weekend
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 11:36 am | PermalinkParticularly annoying as the ABs were wearing a “change strip” as the home side’s strip is usually too similar to the All Black (traditionally Dark Blue). Then what do we get? Scotland in some sort of Abortion of a uniform, the ABs also in a pretty yucky looking jersey, and they look almost identical!
Farcical.
Can’t comment on the actual game — still locked away in the innards of the hard drive recorder …
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 11:43 am | PermalinkI thought Gregan was very ordinary from the breakdown, how many times did the opposition scrumhalf create a turnover? Hugely worrying. Still, he was good on the attack and the defence.
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 12:08 pm | PermalinkOn reflection we lacked Mortlock. He has a commanding presence now with the team, embodying a centralised take no prisoners purpose. We missed that centralising force, playing a game that was somewhat gutted. And the edges were pretty loose as well. This could be put down as well to an onfield captain whose leadership head seems to lose its edge (as though going through the motions) on days when another personal record is being loudly touted. Morts has taken to the captaincy with serious aplomb. This game shows he’s vital to our prospects.
I still can’t get out my head the images of the Fijian’s having been awarded penalties on their tryline and taking the quick tap. Perhaps it’s a nostalgic thing, because that was more common? but, no, it’s the sheer here-and-now thrill of it which is a total buzz. And it’s effective – gaining forty or so metres often with the ball still in hand, with the opposition playing catchups. Geez I bloody love it. Heart in mouth, bust the rules, let’s just run this thing and back split-second thinking.
It helps of course to have thighs like telegraph poles and hands like front end loaders. Maybe red and white eyes bulging like blazes serves its part; and a national background of being so good at running the ball in Sevens that (at times) they’ve been omitted from tournaments because, as an Australian Sevens coach once said, “they always ***’ win it.”
Fiji. Fantastic, unique, rugby nation. Frizzle up the tournament you good things.
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 12:43 pm | PermalinkI’m too grumpy to discuss the match, so let me kick Greg Growden around the park. I’ve stuck to my SMH boycott, with the exception of Saturdays, when I have to check out what Alan Ramsey has called the PM each week just for laughs, and Mondays, as I’ve found I can’t do without the tv guide (an area where the Oz conspicuously falls down with its inconvenient and largely non-informative guide in its Saturday review).
Anyway, to the point. As an academic rugby 101 exercise, check out the contrast today between Wayne Smith’s analysis of last night’s match, and Greg Growden’s analysis.
Smith clearly knows his rugby. I can read him and find my perceptions filled out and sharpened, with no room to doubt that he watched the same match that I did. Growden, on the other hand, plainly didn’t go to the same game, or he went on drugs. Actually, the problem Growden clearly has is shown up very brightly here, and that problem is that he has no idea what rugby is about, and he therefore has nothing substantial to discipline his interpretation, which makes him highly susceptible to writing just about anything he feels like. For months, or years, we’ve been reading this big dope rubbish Wallaby (and Waratah) games that were satisfying or even thrilling. Now that he’s in Paris and has discovered that he has had the completely wrong end of the pineapple, he’s gone into reverse. Today, he finds that the worst Wallaby performance of the year means “that they remain alongside New Zealand and South Africa as the main threats of this tournament” (at which, just a month or so ago, they were going to lose to Wales and be lucky to make the semi-finals, according to our Greg). Last night’s match, he writes, was “highly satisfying”. Lord save us from this clown.
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 2:47 pm | PermalinkWonder if Growden is responsible for this, any day now, with SMH coverage, you’ll also get a stick of bubble gum.
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 3:29 pm | PermalinkThat is instructive. Greg even buys into the whole ‘Larkham is under pressure for his spot laugh’ that, as you’ve pointed out CS, Mark Ella cut right through with one word: experience. But Barnes does look like a great option to have on the bench!
Rugby experience, it seems, doesn’t just win world cups, it makes good writers too
I think Robert is about right about Mortlock. We saw it against Wales as well – A little like Jerry Collins for NZ, God save us from playing the semis without him. Latham as well is essential – he is just all that and a bit more.
Interestingly, in a lowish-pressure match admittedly, Huxley looked sharp. Probably did himself more favours in 10 minutes than Waugh in 80!
Robert: Imagine if Sivivatu and Rococoko and Tuqiri were playing for Fiji! And imagine if Jerry Collins, Chris Masoe, Mils Muliaina, Rodney So’oialo and Isaia Toeava were playing for Samoa, and Sione Lauki and ex-canberran Vainikolo for Tonga.
Result 1: the NH wouldn’t get a look-in
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 3:40 pm | PermalinkResult 2: NZ wouldn’t either!
Not really he didn’t. Tuquiri cost himself the try by running into touch when he had to cut in. When Latham was going into the tackle and looking to offload Tuquiri was in touch!
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 3:43 pm | PermalinkYeah, that sort of glib player rating is just plain brainless, as usual – a mask for Growden to play favourites and bag Gregan (who, being a bright bloke, has probably long refused to talk to the ignorant bastard). Reminds me, did I see Cordingly do a rush-up that exposed our defence late in the game, or was I too cranky to be seeing straight by then? This also reminds me, why the hell have we taken a 31-year old no 9 who has had virtually no game time forever, and who was in any event no 9 in the worst Australian provincial team, to France as the understudy to a 34-year old? Are there plans for Cordingly to play on till he’s 35? All I can think is that whatever poor old Jeremy Paul did wrong, Cordingly must have done the opposite – and, meanwhile, another potential Barnsey in Josh Holmes has missed his big chance.
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 4:17 pm | PermalinkBad news and good news on the wires.
The bad news is that there is a lot of talk that Scott Staniforth has buggered his shoulder and may well follow Gerard home. This is a big blow to my mind, as it will take out the Greegs/Gits/Stanni second half switcheroo, which had so much promise.
On the other hand, it looks as if Bernie is going to get a second-half run this week. Don’t get me wrong, I’m thrilled for Barnes’ tour to date. But Bernie he ain’t, at least not yet. Not only are we only just discovering how good Barnsey is, so is Barnsey himself, and we haven’t got room for that sort of experimentation at the deep end of the tourny unless we have no other option, regardless of whatever crazy delusions Growden indulges. It’s a great credit to Barnsey that he fully understands this:
Barnes immediately dismissed thoughts of Larkham’s return increasing pressure on him. “No. Get him back as soon as possible. I think the whole of Australia want that as well,” said the humble Queenslander. “I think he’s moved a lot better than he ever has with that knee so it would be good to have him back.” Barnes assessed England as a 20-point better team with Jonny Wilkinson back in the No.10 jersey. “If I got the opportunity I’d love to play (Wilkinson),” he said. “He’s someone I’ve looked up to and I admire the way he plays.” “But for Australia’s sake I hope Bernie (Larkham) is back.”
This kid will go far!
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 4:41 pm | PermalinkAgree re those ratings & Growden
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 5:29 pm | Permalinkagree re Paul
agree re Splinters
agree re Holmes – but that he was never given the game time when Gregan was out, that he needed to have been given.
agree re Larkham
agree re Staniforth – poor bloke. In fact two better blokes than he and Gerrard would be hard to imagine. At least Gerrard is young enough to get another crack.
agree re Barnes, too.
Great news in that Staniforth looks to be in the clear. He did set off an intriguing round of second guessing. Ryan Cross? Would Morgan Turinui, who has been in top form, get a recall from the backblocks? Would Julian Huxley seize the moment? Relax, Stani looks to be good.
Meanwhile, Knuckles has let it be known he wasn’t happy. What will Greg Growden think? As I’m coming to terms with all that unnerving looseness, some unknown proportion of which can be put down to Fiji fizz, as Robert eloquently reminds us, I’m thinking this match was the goof-off that we had to have, before we get serious. It was the last laugh saloon, so to speak, before we ride into the valley of being deadly serious. Kiddy time is coming to a close. Soon, we’ll really see what these Wallabies are made of.
Posted on 24-Sep-07 at 11:52 pm | PermalinkExactly.
Along those lines, this match being what it was came from a combination of things starting with the fact thirteen top line Fijians weren’t running on (if the commentators can be believed). That hardly brings the boys into focus. Playing at “home” in non-traditional rugby atmosphere which had been full of distractions, in the sun (afternoon), in the heat. The point is there was no reason for the team to psyche the bejeesus out of themselves, building up massive world-conquering intensity and focus. However, that’s all no excuse for the things performed poorly. And a bit tough to take in staying up late to watch on a Sunday.
But there were some beaut tries scored and some excellent moments nonetheless.
The Knuckles comments would be interesting – the link there cs is to the same article. And relieving news about Staniforth.
Posted on 25-Sep-07 at 12:28 am | PermalinkOne thing that I got out of the Fijian game was that the Reds were mad to let Mosese Rauluni go. The guy can slot into just about any position in the backline, and is also a tidy flanker. He was in the Australian schoolboys as a flanker, Queensland U19s as a halfback and Australian U19s as a centre (I may have the QLD and Oz U19s positions the wrong way around, it was a long time ago).
I don’t think Australia played as badly as you guys are letting on. Australia ran some very slick set pieces against Fiji and when they did this they almost always came away with points. Most of the way through the game Australia settled for not trying anything too fancy. They should be mildly concerned about defence, but some of the Fijian attacking players can easily match the best of the Wallabies defenders in a 1-on-1 contest.
Posted on 25-Sep-07 at 12:39 am | PermalinkIt is more the 4-on-1 we are worried about!
Posted on 25-Sep-07 at 6:29 am | PermalinkRobert, I can’t easily find the same link, but have added another, which looks almost the same. The view from the Knuckles:
“Some guys worked hard. Some didn’t, and we lost our shape a bit,” Connolly said yesterday. “It tends to happen in some games where you think you’ve just got to turn up to win, and there was a little bit of that. “It was loose. Mentally, we just weren’t there at times. We played as individuals. We didn’t get any go forward. “It was hot. It was uncomfortable. It was a game they thought they’d win.”
Posted on 25-Sep-07 at 7:48 am | PermalinkThat reminds me, I was dissapointed in the Wallabies rolling maul. It was a bit of a shambles. Also, Phil Waugh was a bit of a disaster, it seemed to me like he had very little impact on the game. I think Smith will be the first choice for all the big games to come.
Posted on 25-Sep-07 at 8:29 am | PermalinkThanks Chris. As in all tournaments, the lead up games have pluses and minuses. Like your update comment, I’m sensing we will need to ramp up the intensity of our own accord if we are to face England. (This story might get the blood moving).
I’ve a mate who coached in Canada and I’ll try to get some insight on the team if he’s got any; but the concerns now are that they’ll not present enough of what we need in order to be sharpened up. Australians famously rise to an occasion – we’ll beat the All Blacks – but only if we prepare correctly. My two bobs is that we have to not treat this Canada game as a “workout” (not dismissing the obvious need to focus and win) in tournament terms, or as a “step along the way” because that would rely too much on the opposition to provide for us what we need right now. Instead, we should take command now, and secure in absolutes the essentials we need to take the field the week later.
It’s a subtle point, about changing your tournament focus from “training/testing” type games to claiming command, centralising your power, building up silent internal the steam-roller which creates your wins. Canada could easily be regarded as another training/testing game, but my bobs is we can’t afford to do that. So far, our trajectory is fine, but we haven’t centralised the power, and we’ll get caught out against England if we expect it to just happen. We have to begin to be convincing.
Patrick, I don’t recognise many of those names you’ve taken the time to spell and consider; perhaps if they were spoken I’d pick them up. Are some Leaguies? (Can’t watch that game, at all, sorry). If one thing is coming out this World Cup is the need to provide assistance to the Pacific nations, if for no other reason than they hold keys to a future considerably protected by corporate persuasion. If they played for millions per match, one suspects they’d still throw grid iron passes to their wingers, tape from the try line, run with the ball lashing around in one hand…
(Recall a great story about Tonga touring here moons ago, when very competitive. The coach decided to surprise the team with a video of their homeland to connect the players with inspiration and a reason to do-or-die on the paddock the next day, reminded by the video of the great nation they loved and were representing. Summoned to the Australian hotel conference room, the coach played the video and one by one they started weeping until the lot of them bawled hopelessly with homesickness. Gotta love them.)
And Mosese plays like his name suggests.
Posted on 25-Sep-07 at 8:46 am | PermalinkOne was an ex-aussie-then-british-leaguey-now-british-uniony (Vainikolo/Volcana at Gloucester), one was an Aussie (Tuquiri) all the rest are in the All Black’s best 22. In fact 6 of them are in the AB’s best 15, and one of them is the heart and soul of the team (Jerry Collins of Samoa).
Posted on 25-Sep-07 at 9:56 am | PermalinkPatrick,
This old chestnut about the ABs stealing pacific island talent is a bit tired. Here is a list post on rec.sport.rugby.union which lists the countries at the world cup and the number of “donated” players, the number of “stolen” players and the net result:
Posted on 25-Sep-07 at 12:54 pm | PermalinkI couldn’t find the post so I don’t know what context or qualifications were offered but as is in this context is it bullshit.
The eight kiwi ‘takes’ are all accounted for by players in the 22 players that will be selected for the semis. I don’t believe that there are 22 kiwi-born internationals running around for other teams at all. I presume that means that there are 22 capped internationals who have played in NZ at some stage. Wow. That is also why England are such high ‘givers’.
SA are partly that and also they lost a lot of players because their parents left when they were still babies for obvious reasons.
And finally some of both of those numbers come from players getting to about 20-22 and figuring that they aren’t going to make it for NZ/RSA so as much try their chances in Wales/Scotland/etc. Which again I regard as a bit different.
Apples with oranges = bullshit.
Posted on 25-Sep-07 at 1:21 pm | PermalinkPatrick, belief is not required.
Here are the ones I could find on a search of rugbyworldcup.com. Note that this list contains 27 names, and some of these players (e.g. Levi) are injured, which might be the reason for the discrepancy between this figure and the 22 quoted above.
Japan – Bryce Robins, Place of birth: New Plymouth (New Zealand)
Japan – Philip O’Reilly, Place of birth: Hamilton (New Zealand)
Japan – Luke Thompson, Place of birth: Christchurch (New Zealand)
Japan – Hare Makiri, Place of birth: Thames (New Zealand)
Italy – Kaine Robertson, Place of birth: Auckland (New Zealand)
Italy = Paul Griffen, Place of birth: Dunedin (New Zealand)
Italy – Josh Sole, Place of birth: Hamilton (New Zealand)
Tonga – Ephraim Taukafa, Place of birth: Auckland (New Zealand)
Samoa – Junior Polu, Place of birth: Otahuhu (New Zealand)
Samoa – Sailosi Tagicakibau, Place of birth: Auckland (New Zealand)
Samoa – Kas Lealamanua, Place of birth: Wellington (New Zealand)
Samoa – Census Johnston, Place of birth: Auckland (New Zealand)
Samoa – Kane Thompson, Place of birth: Paraparaumu (New Zealand)
Samoa – Daniel Leo, Place of birth: Palmerston North (New Zealand)
Samoa – Justin Purdie, Place of birth: Wellington (New Zealand)
Samoa – Gavin Williams, Place of birth: Auckland (New Zealand)
Samoa – Justin Va’a, Place of birth: Lower Hutt (New Zealand)
Samoa – Tanielu Fuga, Place of birth: Auckland (New Zealand)
Samoa – Leo Lafaiali’I, Place of birth: Auckland (New Zealand)
Samoa – Lome Fa’atau, Place of birth: Wellington (New Zealand)
Samoa – Fosi Palaamo, Place of birth: Murupara (New Zealand)
Samoa – Filipo Levi, Place of birth: Hamilton (New Zealand) (injured)
England – Perry Freshwater, Place of birth: Wellington (New Zealand)
Fiji = Nicky Little, Place of birth: Tokoroa (New Zealand)
Wales – Sonny Parker, Place of birth: Thames (New Zealand)
Ireland – Isaac Boss, Place of birth: Tokoroa (New Zealand)
USA – Hayden Mexted, Place of birth: Whakatane (New Zealand)
Joe Rokocoko has lived in NZ since he was 5.
Sitiveni Sivivatu is the dodgiest as he moved to NZ when he was 15 on a “rugby scholarship”.
Still, no current AB was a member of another countries’ U-21 side before playing for New Zealand (Dan Vickerman, Clyde Rathbone (capt.)).
Posted on 25-Sep-07 at 2:29 pm | PermalinkWell, color me silly. I had no idea there were that many Samoan players born in NZ! 14 – that certainly puts a different light on the six Samoan-born ABs. Then again, I understand that Michael Jones was a precedent for the reverse.
The vast majority of those, in fact I suspect every one of them save perhaps Nicky Little, are nonetheless players that were never going to play for NZ. Even though I should just lose gracefully, a part of me does feel that that is different to the case where a country’s best players are playing in another team.
Which, I suspect, is what most other people are complaining of too. But then again, there is an argument, and clearly especially for Samoa, that playing in NZ makes their national teams better.
Posted on 25-Sep-07 at 4:54 pm | Permalink[...] Comment on Paris 2007: Fiji by Aidan NZ 28 8 20. SA 15 2 13. England 13 4 9. Argentina 8 1 7. Tonga 6 1 5. Fiji 5 1 4. Romania 0 0 0. Georgia 0 0 0. Canada 2 3 -1. France 2 4… [...]
Posted on 25-Sep-07 at 5:50 pm | PermalinkMeanwhile, it’s a heartbreaker for Bernie:
WALLABY five-eighth Stephen Larkham was in a Montpellier hospital bed last night refusing to concede his latest knee dramas have ended his World Cup campaign. The 102-Test veteran, who is likely to spend a further 24 hours receiving specialist treatment for an infection in the joint, spoke to The Daily Telegraph shortly after news broke of his second arthroscopic surgery for the tournament. “There’s still hope that I’ll play again,” he said. “The best case scenario for me would be the quarter-final but I’d also be very happy if it was the semi-final a week later. It’s a matter of getting the swelling down now. It was a more intrusive procedure than the first one (on September 16). But I’ve had some good news already. They thought I was going to be in hospital for four days. It looks now like I’ll get out tomorrow.”
Woe, oh woe is us.
Posted on 26-Sep-07 at 2:57 am | Permalinkand Mondays, as Ive found I cant do without the tv guide (an area where the Oz conspicuously falls down with its inconvenient and largely non-informative guide in its Saturday review)
Buy the Terror on Wednesdays.
Posted on 26-Sep-07 at 8:25 am | PermalinkBuy the Terror on Wednesdays.
Do I also have to empty half my brains out?
Posted on 26-Sep-07 at 10:56 am | PermalinkDo I also have to empty half my brains out?
It’s too late for me, I’m a mungo already and there’s no going back. But you should be able to avoid this fate by taking a few simple precautions.
Myself and colleagues at the Max Planck Institute have calculated you have three point four eight seconds of visual exposure to the front page before spontaneous degeneration begins. On most occasions you will find this adequate to ascertain the exact position of the liftout within the paper, extract it in its entirity and dispose of the rest (first ensuring you are no more than one metre from the nearest WorkCover approved lead-lined receptacle.) This information is for educational purposes only and no responsibility is taken for injury or loss sustained.
Posted on 26-Sep-07 at 11:24 am | PermalinkScientific warning of serious and extreme danger noted.
But what about the real questions? Is it just a cover for promoting Fox? Does it have critical movie reviews and program assessments, or is it just p/r handouts about soap and celebs? Most important of all, is the liftout stapled?
Posted on 26-Sep-07 at 11:00 pm | PermalinkNo staples. ;-(
Posted on 27-Sep-07 at 6:55 am | PermalinkDon’t buy that crap, just put this in your bookmarks: http://www.yourtv.com.au/
I’m not a polynesian language expert, but I do know quite a few Maori, and many of those names look suspiciously Samoan to me, not Maori. But hey, if they were born in gawdzown, that’s good enuff.
Posted on 27-Sep-07 at 10:34 am | PermalinkDont buy that crap, just put this in your bookmarks: http://www.yourtv.com.au/
I made a visit. With all due respect to folks who like the internet, give me the pleasure and convenience of a clearly set out, printed and stapled weekly guide for $1.20, aaaaaaanydaaaaaaay …
Posted on 27-Sep-07 at 1:39 pm | Permalinkwilful,
They are Samoan names. They play for Samoa. They were born in NZ.
I was trying to show that NZ provides far more players than they take to other teams, particularly Pacific Island teams.
Posted on 27-Sep-07 at 4:16 pm | Permalink… than they take from other teams … sorry.
Posted on 27-Sep-07 at 4:17 pm | Permalink